Subject: Re: H.323/VoIP QoS (further to Randy Bloomfield's note)

From: "Eric Hauch" <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 03 Mar 1999 15:49:38 -0600

Joon,

My name is Eric Hauch.  I am the current Ad Hoc Group leader for a Working Group T1A1.5 activity that appears to closely parallel your initiative.

Committee T1 (of which TSC T1A1 is part) is an open standards forum sponsored by the Alliance for Telecommunications Industry Solutions (ATIS) and accredited by the American National Standards Institute (ANSI).  As such, Committee T1 is the ANSI authority in the United States for defining telecommunications interface and performance standards.  Committee T1 TSC's are also a key source of research and advice to the US State Department's delegations to the ITU - and have formal liaisons with the IETF.

The current Ad Hoc Group work on defining multimedia performance requirements for business quality conferences carried over IP based networks is part of addressing these standards setting responsibilities.  We very much share the reasons you state for needing these QoS standards soon.

The work of the MMoIP Ad Hoc Group is about 60% complete (i.e. we're just over half way to making a recommendation to send our draft standard to T1 letter ballot).  The last Ad Hoc group conference call was Feb 25, 99 - the next, Apr 1, 99.  Attendance and participation in any T1 activity is completely open.  Voting at the TSC and T1 levels is by membership (for example, VTel is a member of T1A1).

You can find out more about TSC T1A1, WG T1A1.5 and the Ad Hoc Group activities (through the posted documentation) at www.t1.org.  As past chair of WG T1A1.5, I have enjoyed VTel's excellent past contributions to our efforts and have been very supportive and encouraging of VTel's particpation in this particular Ad Hoc group.  To the extent your initiative indicates a renewed interest on your part and others in your industry segment, I am delighted - and encourage and welcome all of you to work with us.

I'll look forward to hearing from you,

Eric G. Hauch
Vice-Chair T1A1
615-532-2365
[email-masked]

>>> "Joon Maeng" <[email-masked]> 03/03 10:40 AM >>>
Greetings!  My name is Joon Maeng.  I work for VTEL Corp in USA. I've talked to
several companies while I was attending ITU and IETF meetings about establishing
an ad-hoc group to address QoS (Quality of Service) issues in TRANSPORTING
REAL-TIME TRAFFICS in the packet switched network, especially in the IP network.
I was very encouraged by responses from those companies.  Most of them agreed
that lack of QoS support for real-time traffics  was one of major barriers in
deploying H.323/VoIP products and  the H.323 industry would benefit by having a
QoS activity group.  I would like to ask if your company would be interested in
the activities described in the following:

Proposed name of the group: H.323/VoIP QoS Activity Group.

Motivation:  ITU defined a good conference standard, H.323, for the packet
network.  IETF is actively defining QoS standards for the IP network. The
deployment of H.323/VoIP products has been slow partially due to lack of QoS
supports in current IP network.  The H.323/VoIP industry shall work together to
access the issues and provide solutions for the users.

Proposed charter of the group:
- Assess QoS issues in transporting real-time traffics (calls with long-duration
compared to web-access) in the IP network,
- Find the solutions to resolve issues,
- Execute solutions via various processes such as building consensus on various
QoS solutions among participants,
  submitting recommendations to standardization bodies if needed, and
facilitating inter-operablity testing between QoS standards and application
  standards,
- and education,  promotion, etc.

I would expect the final charter and the structure of the group will be
determined by the participants and their interests.    I would say that
everything is open at this time except that the industry shall look at the QoS
issues seriously for real-time traffics.  I'd like to clarify that the proposed
group is not a group to standardize the QoS.  It is a group or a forum that is
interested in helping and promoting the real-time QoS for H.323/VoIP industry
through various methods (to be determined).   I plan to set up an email
reflector for the initial discussions among participants and decide the
following steps based on the discussions. Please email me (joon_maeng@ vtel.com)
if you and your company would be interested in joining the initial talks via
email reflector.   Your comments and suggestions will be greatly appreciated.
Regards,
Joon

---

From: Christian Kuhtz <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 3 Mar 1999 17:14:02 -0500

Eric,

I think the purpose of this group is to discuss and explore ways of providing
IP QoS for VoIP networks, and to evaluate applicable existing technology as
well as provide feedback for emerging technology.

I don't quite understand why we need a managed membership committee to run 
this -- particularly the managed membership part is what I find troubling.  
What benefit are you providing?

Personally, I find this difficult to define, because you are obviously not the
premier forum for IP related issues (the IETF is).  Please explain.

So, if you're affiliated with the IETF, why don't you participate in our 
working group rather than we move our IP network related issues into T1?

And, was it really neccessary to carbon copy over half a dozen mailing lists
on this subject matter?

Thanks in advance.

Cheers,
Chris

-- 
      "Kannst du nicht allen gefallen durch deine That und dein Kunstwerk --
       mach es wenigen recht, vielen gefallen ist schlimm"  -- Schiller

[Disclaimer: I speak for myself and my views are my own and not in any way to
             be construed as the views of BellSouth Corporation. ]

---

From: "Eric Hauch" <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 03 Mar 1999 16:44:38 -0600

Chris,

Thanks for your note.

Firstly I simply used Joon's mailing list (plus some of the T1 folks).  I see you did this as well - which is good (keeps everyone informed).

Committee T1 is not affiliated with the IETF but various T1 groups work in concert with the IETF on a fairly wide range of issues, this being one of them.  For instance, when we first started the MMoIP project, I gave a presentation to the IETF in Memphis to explain what we're doing and why.  Various members of T1A1 also participate in the IETF - and the IETF leadership has and is participating in our work.

Working Groups are managed by Committee T1 but are not voting bodies.  Anyone and everyone is welcome to attend and participate - the same is true for the Ad Hoc groups (which are really just topic-focused subsets of WG's).  One of the values of T1 comes at standards setting time - and this is a decided by member votes in keeping with the general requirements for ANSI accreditation.

Please understand, my note is not intended to discourage Joon's initiative - but rather to offer the work T1A1 has already done, to leverage our respective memberships and to provide a clear path to getting a standard (reference Joon's 4th charter point).  This I'm sure was the spirit of Randy's note as well.

Eric

>>> Christian Kuhtz <[email-masked]> 03/03 4:14 PM >>>

Eric,

Thanks in advance.

Cheers,
Chris

---

From: [email-masked]
Date: Thu, 4 Mar 1999 12:00:03 -0600

Please do not include me in your future e-mails.

-----Original Message-----
From: ehauch 
Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 1999 3:50 PM
To: Joon.Maeng
Cc: ehauch; diff-serv-interest; h323implementors; interwkg; voip; 
int-serv; neal; ITU-SG16; t1a12; t1a15; mpls
Subject: Re: H.323/VoIP QoS (further to Randy Bloomfield's note)

Joon,

My name is Eric Hauch.  I am the current Ad Hoc Group leader for a 
Working Group T1A1.5 activity that appears to closely parallel your 
initiative.

Committee T1 (of which TSC T1A1 is part) is an open standards forum 
sponsored by the Alliance for Telecommunications Industry Solutions 
(ATIS) and accredited by the American National Standards Institute 
(ANSI).  As such, Committee T1 is the ANSI authority in the United 
States for defining telecommunications interface and performance 
standards.  Committee T1 TSC's are also a key source of research and 
advice to the US State Department's delegations to the ITU - and have 
formal liaisons with the IETF.

The current Ad Hoc Group work on defining multimedia performance 
requirements for business quality conferences carried over IP based 
networks is part of addressing these standards setting 
responsibilities.  We very much share the reasons you state for needing 
these QoS standards soon.

The work of the MMoIP Ad Hoc Group is about 60% complete (i.e. we're 
just over half way to making a recommendation to send our draft 
standard to T1 letter ballot).  The last Ad Hoc group conference call 
was Feb 25, 99 - the next, Apr 1, 99.  Attendance and participation in 
any T1 activity is completely open.  Voting at the TSC and T1 levels is 
by membership (for example, VTel is a member of T1A1).

You can find out more about TSC T1A1, WG T1A1.5 and the Ad Hoc Group 
activities (through the posted documentation) at www.t1.org.  As past 
chair of WG T1A1.5, I have enjoyed VTel's excellent past contributions 
to our efforts and have been very supportive and encouraging of VTel's 
particpation in this particular Ad Hoc group.  To the extent your 
initiative indicates a renewed interest on your part and others in your 
industry segment, I am delighted - and encourage and welcome all of you 
to work with us.

Eric G. Hauch
Vice-Chair T1A1
615-532-2365
[email-masked]

>>> "Joon Maeng" <[email-masked]> 03/03 10:40 AM >>>
Greetings!  My name is Joon Maeng.  I work for VTEL Corp in USA. I've 
talked to
several companies while I was attending ITU and IETF meetings about 
establishing
an ad-hoc group to address QoS (Quality of Service) issues in 
TRANSPORTING
REAL-TIME TRAFFICS in the packet switched network, especially in the IP 
network.
I was very encouraged by responses from those companies.  Most of them 
agreed
that lack of QoS support for real-time traffics  was one of major 
barriers in
deploying H.323/VoIP products and  the H.323 industry would benefit by 
having a
QoS activity group.  I would like to ask if your company would be 
interested in
the activities described in the following:

Motivation:  ITU defined a good conference standard, H.323, for the 
packet
network.  IETF is actively defining QoS standards for the IP network. 
The
deployment of H.323/VoIP products has been slow partially due to lack 
of QoS
supports in current IP network.  The H.323/VoIP industry shall work 
together to
access the issues and provide solutions for the users.

Proposed charter of the group:
- Assess QoS issues in transporting real-time traffics (calls with 
long-duration
compared to web-access) in the IP network,
- Find the solutions to resolve issues,
- Execute solutions via various processes such as building consensus on 
various
QoS solutions among participants,
  submitting recommendations to standardization bodies if needed, and
facilitating inter-operablity testing between QoS standards and 
application
  standards,
- and education,  promotion, etc.

I would expect the final charter and the structure of the group will be
determined by the participants and their interests.    I would say that
everything is open at this time except that the industry shall look at 
the QoS
issues seriously for real-time traffics.  I'd like to clarify that the 
proposed
group is not a group to standardize the QoS.  It is a group or a forum 
that is
interested in helping and promoting the real-time QoS for H.323/VoIP 
industry
through various methods (to be determined).   I plan to set up an email
reflector for the initial discussions among participants and decide the
following steps based on the discussions. Please email me (joon_maeng@ 
vtel.com)
if you and your company would be interested in joining the initial 
talks via
email reflector.   Your comments and suggestions will be greatly 
appreciated.
Regards,
Joon

 << File: Re_ H.TXT >>

---

From: "Demosthenes Kostas" <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 4 Mar 99 15:33:30 -0600

Could you translate it for some of us that don't read French 

Kannst du nicht allen gefallen durch deine That und dein Kunstwerk --
       mach es wenigen recht, vielen gefallen ist schlimm"  -- Schiller

---------------------------------------------
Demosthenes Kostas PhD/MBA 
Manager-Industry Standards
GTE 
700 Hidden Ridge, HQW02J85
Irving, TX 75038
(972) 718-6291    FAX: (972) 718-4393
Internet: [email-masked]
 
-------------
Original Text
From: "Christian Kuhtz" <[email-masked]>, on 3/3/99 4:14 PM:
Eric,

I think the purpose of this group is to discuss and explore ways of 
providing
IP QoS for VoIP networks, and to evaluate applicable existing technology 
as
well as provide feedback for emerging technology.

Personally, I find this difficult to define, because you are obviously not 
the
premier forum for IP related issues (the IETF is).  Please explain.

And, was it really neccessary to carbon copy over half a dozen mailing 
lists
on this subject matter?

Thanks in advance.

Cheers,
Chris

-- 
      "Kannst du nicht allen gefallen durch deine That und dein Kunstwerk 
--
       mach es wenigen recht, vielen gefallen ist schlimm"  -- Schiller

[Disclaimer: I speak for myself and my views are my own and not in any way 
to
             be construed as the views of BellSouth Corporation. ]
*