Subject: Re: [Asrg] 2.a.1. Spam Measurements - Data - Unsubscribe

From: "John Fenley" <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 08 Aug 2003 17:01:42 -0600

----- Original Message -----
From: "Yakov Shafranovich" <[email-masked]>
>After trying to do unsubscribe from every spam that I got in a poisoned 
>account, I came with some interesting observations. Of course there is not 
>enough data to make this statistically correct but the empirical 
>observations are interesting.
>
>  From all the spams that were received in this account in the last 2 days, 
>most seem to come from four specific sources. All these sources had 
>unsubscribe pages. When I tried to unsubscribe twice, I got a warning that 
>the address has already been removed. I tried doing this a day apart, it 
>still worked. You can see for yourself at:
>
>http://www.med21sx.com/a.html
>
>What I am getting from this is that these four specific spammers maintain 
>"remove" lists. One possible reason for them to do so, is that sending spam 
>to people that do not want it anymore, will not provide spammers with any 
>possibility of extra revenue, and may hurt them in the long run because 
>those people if still receiving the spam, will report the spammers. Of 
>course, the other reason could be that its all a ploy or a verify 
>operation.
>
>In any case, we need more data on this and preferably a large-scale study.
>
>Yakov

I have found that after about a week the sources that used to send the spam 
actually do stop. Then new sources start sending. Then they stop, and all 
that is left is the ones without unsubscribes. By some odd twist even those 
seem to have slowed down for me.

John Fenley

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---

From: Shaun Bryant <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 8 Aug 2003 17:58:13 -0700

From the tests that I have done with various honey-pot accounts I have seen
a great increase in the amount of spam that the account receives when I
"unsubscribed". I believe it depends a lot on the type of spam you are using
in your test. Was the spam mostly bulk, or was it semi-solicited? Where the
e-mails originated from somewhere the account you where testing with gave
the address out to that may have "shared" it with other organizations? 

Shaun  

> -----Original Message-----
> From: C Wegrzyn [mailto:[email-masked]]
> Sent: Friday, August 08, 2003 3:54 PM
> To: Yakov Shafranovich
> Cc: [email-masked]
> Subject: Re: [Asrg] 2.a.1. Spam Measurements - Data - Unsubscribe
> 
>  From what I've heard about the unsubscribe issue is that once you "try"
> to unsubscribe they actually know there is active account. There is a
> spammer in Burlington MA that uses this technique to build email lists.
> I also understand they will send out "free things" types of emails to
> get you to come to the site.
> 
> Chuck Wegrzyn
> 
> 
> Yakov Shafranovich wrote:
> > account, I came with some interesting observations. Of course there is
> > not enough data to make this statistically correct but the empirical
> >  From all the spams that were received in this account in the last 2
> > days, most seem to come from four specific sources. All these sources
> > had unsubscribe pages. When I tried to unsubscribe twice, I got a
> > warning that the address has already been removed. I tried doing this a
> > day apart, it still worked. You can see for yourself at:
> >
> > What I am getting from this is that these four specific spammers
> > maintain "remove" lists. One possible reason for them to do so, is that
> > sending spam to people that do not want it anymore, will not provide
> > spammers with any possibility of extra revenue, and may hurt them in the
> > long run because those people if still receiving the spam, will report
> > the spammers. Of course, the other reason could be that its all a ploy
> > or a verify operation.
> >
> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> ---------------------------
> >
> > Yakov Shafranovich / <[email-masked]>
> > SolidMatrix Research, a division of SolidMatrix Technologies, Inc.
> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> ---------------------------
> >
> > "One who watches the wind will never sow, and one who keeps his eyes on
> > the clouds will never reap" (Ecclesiastes 11:4)
> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> ---------------------------
> >
> >

---

From: Yakov Shafranovich <[email-masked]>
Date: Sat, 09 Aug 2003 22:54:00 -0400

Most of it was bulk email with mainly mortgages and viagra pills offers. 
However, I do not think my data is large enough to qualify for anything, I 
was trying to raise interest in the issue so we can do a large scale study 
on it.