Subject: [decade] WG review of draft-ietf-decade-problem-statement-00

From: "David A. Bryan" <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2010 08:35:55 -0500

Please find my WG review of draft-ietf-decade-problem-statement-00
below. (sorry, I was working off -00 before -01 came out)

Summary:

This document captures the problem quite well. Despite being an early
revision, the work is a result of extensive on-list discussion, and
reflects group consensus well. The draft is well written and conveys
the group's intent well.

Specific comments/concerns:

Section 3.2, third point: I think this is specifically about
encrypted/private protocols where the messages are hidden/encrypted
(the part about proprietary overlaps with point one otherwise) Might
be worth mentioning here that if protocols are closed and encrypted,
they may not be willing to use a open standard like DECADE either...it
seems DECADE is well suited to address the first two, but seems less
likely to help with the third point.

Section 4, description of interaction between DECADE and PPSP. I'm not
sure we really need quite that level of description/specification
about interaction with PPSP. Essentially, this section describes how
any P2P network/application for streaming would work with DECADE, not
just a PPSP deployment. That section almost seems like the usage
scenarios in 5...it feels out of place at this point in the document,
and just seems like far too much content here. I actually think if we
leave it in we should shorten the part on PPSP and we should move all
the content about how this interacts with other WGs, starting with
"Note that..." on page 8 up until the end of section 4.0, except the
last sentence in 4.0 about DECADE being applicable to other
applications into a new section 6 after 5, since it is more clear how
things interact once we understand what DECADE is better (which
section 5 helps with) Might be better to have a section in 5 on how
DECADE works with a streaming scenario (generically) and then can just
in passing mention that PPSP would be one streaming scenario that
could use DECADE in the new section 6.

In section 5.1, second para, when describing the downloading of data
between two BitTorrent clients, it indicates that A downloads from B
and stores in A's in-network storage. I think that is optional, right?
A might decide to download directly. The first full paragraph on page
11 further explains why you would want to store in your own storage as
you download, but doesn't make clear that nothing in the protocol
forces you to do so. You do explain this in examples in 5.3, but might
want to indicate here that A storing in storage is optional.

While we don't want to discuss DRM directly, it may be worth noting in
the content provider example that the provider can still apply DRM to
the payload independently of the authentication build into DECADE if
they desire. I would expect most would. If nothing else, you might
want to mention this in 6.2, but might also mention it in passing in
section 5.2. (what I mean here is that I can still encrypt my chunks
some other way if I want, and use DECADE to store them)

Nits:

Page 3, para 2, last sentence: Odd to start sentence with "Neither".

Page 4, beginning of second line in section 3 should be "application"
not "applications"

Section 3.1, last paragraph (the one on LEDBAT). About the middle of
the paragraph, there is an extra space after "traffic".

Section 3.3, last paragraph, "it becomes" should be "it is becoming"

Page 8, in the big para discussing PPSP, "Cache" should not be capitalized.

Page 8, last section (first scenario): Don't need "say" after "e.g."

---

From: Songhaibin <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 23 Dec 2010 03:35:26 +0000

Hi David,

Thank you for your review. Please see in line.

________________________________________
From: [email-masked] [[email-masked]] on behalf of David A. Bryan [[email-masked]]
Sent: Tuesday, December 21, 2010 9:35 PM
To: DECADE
Subject: [decade] WG review of draft-ietf-decade-problem-statement-00

Summary:

[Haibin] I think I need to make a clarification here. Even an application uses encrypted protocol for the signaling, it can also use the open standard for data transport, with the data iteself being encrypted.

section 5 helps with) 

[Haibin] I agree with you. Actually in 01 version, we have already moved this part to the appendix.

>Might be better to have a section in 5 on how
DECADE works with a streaming scenario (generically) 

[Haibin] Good suggestion. 

>and then can just

In section 5.1, second para, when describing the downloading of data
between two BitTorrent clients, it indicates that A downloads from B
and stores in A's in-network storage. I think that is optional, right?
A might decide to download directly. 

[Haibin] Yes. This is just one scenario. Just like you said, A might download from B's in-network storage directly.

The first full paragraph on page

[Haibin] In the second paragraph of section 5.3, it says "Each user independently decides if its in-network storage account is used...". Is this enough or do you want to add more sentences?

[Haibin] OK. I agree. And it will be added in the new version.

Nits:

[Haibin] Thank you very much for pointing these nits out. I will correct them.

Thank you again,
Haibin

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