Subject: [dtn-users] dtn multicasting -?

From: "Victor Lyamtsev" <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 28 Dec 2012 15:28:54 +0000

Hello,
Is there any completed standard/ implementation of bundle multicasting?
P.S. I am not asking about something like NORM convergence layer with multicasting over ip, but the scenario with non-ip transport... 
Thank you,

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From: "Ivancic, William D. (GRC-RHN0)" <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 28 Dec 2012 12:33:05 -0600

I don't believe there is any formal "standard" for DTN multicasting so an
implementation of a standard is problematic.  I think there have been some
experimentation.  It is a naming thing as well as routing.

You may checkout the following for guidance and ideas.  Scott may have even
implemented some of this for ION, but ION is generally geared toward
scheduled contacts.  That may not fit your needs.

http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-burleigh-dtnrg-imc/?include_text=1

 Will

> From: Victor Lyamtsev <[email-masked]>
> Date: Fri, 28 Dec 2012 09:28:54 -0600
> To: "[email-masked]" <[email-masked]>
> Subject: [dtn-users] dtn multicasting -?
> 
> Hello,
> P.S. I am not asking about something like NORM convergence layer with
> multicasting over ip, but the scenario with non-ip transport...
> Thank you,
> _______________________________________________
> dtn-users mailing list
> [email-masked]
> https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/dtn-users

---

From: "Ivancic, William D. (GRC-RHN0)" <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 28 Dec 2012 12:35:45 -0600

This may help also:

http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-pbasu-dtnrg-naming-00#section-2.2

Will

*****************************

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From: "Pitts, Robert L. (MSFC-EO60)[HOSC SERVICES CONTRACT]" <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 28 Dec 2012 12:41:28 -0600

I think you are right Will.  We have talked about some implementations but haven't had the time yet to go much further.  It would be helpful to our payload users.

Lee

-----Original Message-----
From: [email-masked] [mailto:[email-masked]] On Behalf Of Ivancic, William D. (GRC-RHN0)
Sent: Friday, December 28, 2012 12:36 PM
To: Victor Lyamtsev; [email-masked]
Subject: Re: [dtn-users] dtn multicasting -?

This may help also:

Will

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From: Elwyn Davies <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 28 Dec 2012 19:35:30 +0000

Hi.

The nearest thing to multicasting in DTN2 is epidemic routing which
tries to send a received bundle to every other contact that the node
makes until the bundle expires.  

At present the MULTINODE endpoint concept is effectively not implemented
at all in DTN2 although the low levels have the concept defined.  This
would potentially give you a form of multicast group.

The feature has been requested for ION
(http://sourceforge.net/p/ion-dtn/feature-requests/3/) this year.

I would also like to have it for certain ICN-like operations  but
implementing multinode capabilities requires a considerable amount of
work in DTN2:
- allowing nodes to have more than one local EID 
- new discovery/announcement processes for offering auxiliary EIDs as
well as the 'master' one that identifies the administrative name.
- managing 'auxiliary' logical links and routes that use the master
physical link to reach EIDs containing the auxiliary EIDs
- adapting exiting routing/forwarding protocols to deal with MULTINODE
EIDs

It might be possible to simplify the work on routing by treating the
multipoint EID as a form of service on the 'master' EID rather than an
independent EID in its own right.  Thus sending to
dtn://some.multicast.service/zzz which is marked as a MULTIPOINT EID is
effectively equivalent to sending to dtn:/*/some.multicast.service/zzz.

However, don't hold your breath for an imminent implementation in DTN2.

Regards,
Elwyn

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From: "Burleigh, Scott C (313B)" <[email-masked]>
Date: Sat, 29 Dec 2012 00:54:35 +0000

There is an implementation of multicast in ION that conforms to the "imc" Internet Draft that Will referenced.  It's not necessarily limited to a scheduled-contacts environment, but ION itself does not yet have any opportunistic forwarding capability; that may change later this year, but for now you would be stuck with static routing or scheduled contacts.  Also, IMC relies on establishment of a multicast forwarding tree, and currently in ION that has to be done by hand, using an administration program.  A spanning-tree configuration protocol is needed, but it doesn't exist yet.

Scott

-----Original Message-----
From: [email-masked] [mailto:[email-masked]] On Behalf Of Elwyn Davies
Sent: Friday, December 28, 2012 11:36 AM
To: Victor Lyamtsev
Cc: [email-masked]
Subject: Re: [dtn-users] dtn multicasting -?

Hi.

The nearest thing to multicasting in DTN2 is epidemic routing which tries to send a received bundle to every other contact that the node makes until the bundle expires.  

At present the MULTINODE endpoint concept is effectively not implemented at all in DTN2 although the low levels have the concept defined.  This would potentially give you a form of multicast group.

I would also like to have it for certain ICN-like operations  but implementing multinode capabilities requires a considerable amount of work in DTN2:
- allowing nodes to have more than one local EID
- new discovery/announcement processes for offering auxiliary EIDs as well as the 'master' one that identifies the administrative name.
- managing 'auxiliary' logical links and routes that use the master physical link to reach EIDs containing the auxiliary EIDs
- adapting exiting routing/forwarding protocols to deal with MULTINODE EIDs

It might be possible to simplify the work on routing by treating the multipoint EID as a form of service on the 'master' EID rather than an independent EID in its own right.  Thus sending to dtn://some.multicast.service/zzz which is marked as a MULTIPOINT EID is effectively equivalent to sending to dtn:/*/some.multicast.service/zzz.

Regards,
Elwyn

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From: "Ivancic, William D. (GRC-RHN0)" <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 31 Dec 2012 07:26:59 -0600

Victor,  I agree with Elwyn that looking at multicast EID more like a
service may help.  Get a copy of John Day's book Patterns in Network
Architecture - not an easy read.  Chapter 9 goes into multicast,
multi-homing and mobility and such and gives a good discussion on what those
concepts really mean.  In the IP protocol we have multicast addresses, but
they really are not addresses in the normal sense.  Rather a multicast
address represents a set of endpoints.  Thus, a multicast EID represents a
set of EIDs (multicast group members). I think if you look at IP multicast
you can easily confused.

The other thing to consider is what do you really want to accomplish with
multicast?  There may be  better ways.  Information Centric Networking has a
lot of multicast like features that may be all you need.

--Will

******************************

> From: Elwyn Davies <[email-masked]>
> Date: Fri, 28 Dec 2012 13:35:30 -0600
> To: Victor Lyamtsev <[email-masked]>
> Cc: "[email-masked]" <[email-masked]>