Subject: [edu-team] Seoul is Approaching Quickly!

From: Margaret Wasserman <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 14:49:27 -0500

Hi All,

Seoul is about two weeks away, and I want to make sure that we will
be ready.  This is a fairly long note, but it contains a lot of
questions and action items for various people, so please read it
and respond.

I have attached what I think is the current public version of the
Seoul training schedule (does not include WG chairs lunch on Wednesday).
Please review it and let me know if I have made any errors or omissions.
I am planning to announce this information on various IETF lists in
approximately 24 hours, so please let me know right away if there are
any mistakes.

If you are scheduled to present anything, PLEASE write to me and confirm.
Thanks!

Marcia, when you have the room information available for these
sessions, please let me know.  Thanks!

A few open issues:

(1) We will be holding our first non-English training session in
     Seoul, a Korean language Newcomers session taught by ChangJoon
     Kim.  Two questions:

         - Avri, could you please send me Changjoon's e-mail address,
           so that I can contact him to confirm his participation?

         - Do we think that someone from the IETF leadership should
           stop in at the beginning of this session and welcome the
           Korean participants (perhaps with translation)?  Harald
           is this something you would be willing/able to do? (It
           starts at 2pm on Sunday).

(2) Scott Bradner is not available to teach the newcomers training on
     Sunday, as he will not arrive in Korea until Sunday night.  Spencer
     Dawkins has volunteered to teach this session (Thanks, Spencer!).
     Spencer, could you please coordinate with Scott to get his latest
     materials, etc.?

(3) I have not announced a WG chairs lunch session yet, and should do
     so immediately!  Marcia, what should I include as an RSVP date?

     I was thinking of holding a practical session on how to use the
     I-D tracker (public version) to track documents.  It would include
     a presentation that covers document states and the IESG balloting
     process, followed by a demonstration of the I-D Tracker.  If I can get
     a few IESG members (or other experienced document trackers) to
     attend, and if we have wireless, we could even hold a lab. Thoughts?

     I currently have myself listed to teach this session, but I'm
     planning to ask Bill Fenner to do it with me.

     We could also include an additional short topic, if anyone has
     any ideas...  Particularly anything that you are willing to
     organize/present.

(4) For this IETF, we want to get all of our training materials
     included in the proceedings.  So, if you are presenting a session,
     please make sure that your slides are sent to [email-masked]
     after the meeting.  I'll try to remind you...

     It would also be good to keep our web site up-to-date, so if you
     update your presentation materials, please send them to James
     Seng <[email-masked]> (preferably before your session), so
     that he can update the web site.

(5) I will be presenting a very short summary of the EDU activities
     at the General Area meeting on Monday evening.  Do folks have
     any particular thoughts about what we should present?

(6) We are having an edu-team lunch from 11:30am-1:00pm on Tuesday.
     During lunch, I'd like to discuss ideas for the next two or
     three major improvements that we can make to our EDU efforts.
     By the end of Seoul, we will have met our goals for the past
     year: Charter the group, Set-up a web site, Add an Editors class,
     Establish training sessions for ongoing WG chairs, Train WG
     chairs on how to make WGs more accessible to non-NA participants,
     Offer native language Newcomers training -- It has been a great
     year!.  So what goals should we set for the year ahead?

BTW, we have received some great feedback regarding the Korean
language session that is included on the Seoul agenda.  If this
works out well, I hope that we can do native language training
at all IETFs that are held in non-native-English countries.

Please let me know if I seem to be forgetting anything...

See (most of) you in Seoul!

Margaret

--

Sunday, February 29, 2004
=========================

1300-1400  Newcomer's Training in English -- Location??  (Spencer Dawkins)

            An introduction to the IETF for new or recent IETF
            attendees.  Covers the IETF document processes, the
            structure of the IETF, and tips for new attendees to
            be successful in the IETF environment.

1300-1400  Newcomer's Training in Korean -- Location??  (ChangJoon Kim)

            [Include description on agenda in Korean, if possible.]

            An introduction to the IETF for new or recent IETF
            attendees.  Covers the IETF document processes, the
            structure of the IETF, and tips for new attendees to
            be successful in the IETF environment.

1300-1500  Editor's Training -- Location??  (Avri Doria)

            Training for current or aspiring IETF document
            editors.  Covers the roles and responsibilities
            of a document editor, and includes advice on
            producing a high-quality IETF specification.

1300-1500  Intro WG Chairs Training -- Location??  (Margaret Wasserman)

            Introductory training for new or aspiring WG
            chairs.  Covers the role and responsibilities of
            a WG chair, and includes advice on how to run a
            WG that is fair, open and productive.  This class
            is open to all IETF attendees.

1500-1700  Security Tutorial -- Location??  (Radia Perlman)

            All IETF attendees need to be aware of the security
            implications of our design choices.  This session
            offers a basic primer in protocol security, as well
            as advice on how to write the Security Considerations
            sections required for all IETF documents.

Wednesday, February 3, 2004  (Private, NOT on agenda)
===========================

1130-1300  WG Chairs Training Lunch -- Location??

            Using the I-D Tracker to track WG document
            status (Margaret Wasserman)
                - Understanding the document state machine
                - Introduction to the IESG balloting process
                - Demonstration and/or lab

            Includes lunch for attendees.

_______________________________________________
edu-team mailing list
[email-masked]
https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/edu-team

---

From: Margaret Wasserman <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 15:04:48 -0500

>1300-1400  Newcomer's Training in Korean -- Location??  (ChangJoon Kim)

This session is scheduled for 1400-1500 -- Cut-and-paste will
get you every time! :-)

Margaret

---

From: [email-masked]
Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2004 12:35:55 +0900

> If you are scheduled to present anything, PLEASE write to me and 

Consider me confirmed.

>           so that I can contact him to confirm his participation?

[email-masked]

>           starts at 2pm on Sunday).

I think that would be great.  What might also be good is if someone 
actually agreed to sit through the session, not because they would 
understand it, but because it would give Chang a chance to turn to 
someone for any answers to questions he might not have.  This is not 
necessary as I think I have answered all his questions - to the extent 
that i have the right answers, but one never knows what might come up.  
Fr example I gave an internal ETRI presentation on the last IETF and 
one of the questions that came out had to do with and I was asked a 
question on the IPR policies and what might be changing with the 
results of the IPR group.  I had to admit that I have not been 
following that group with anything resembling careful attention and was 
not sure I gave an adequate answer.

>     Spencer, could you please coordinate with Scott to get his latest

And could you please copy Chang on the latest as he will be using the 
same slide set.

>     any ideas...  Particularly anything that you are willing to

How about some time spent on the proposed changes to WG chair roles.

>     that he can update the web site.

A note on this.  The web site keeps the old versions visible on the 
home page as well as the newest ones.  While I think it is good to keep 
an archive of the older stuff, I think it might be confusing to have it 
appear on the home page.

>     year!.  So what goals should we set for the year ahead?

I am assuming there will be many changes percolating through the system 
during the next year.  It might be good to have sessions of changes and 
even proposed changes.

Also session on what MIB Doctors look for might be useful.

---

From: Margaret Wasserman <[email-masked]>
Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2004 09:48:00 -0500

At 12:35 PM 2/14/2004 +0900, [email-masked] wrote:
>And could you please copy Chang on the latest as he will be using the same 
>slide set.

Spencer, could you take Chang under your wing (so to speak)?  Avri and
I will be teaching other sessions during the newcomer's training, and
I'm just furiously busy until Seoul... So, it would be great if you could
send some e-mail to Chang, make him feel like part of the team, make sure
that he has the latest slides (soon, in case he is trying to do any sort
of translation of the slides), that he has a laptop from which he can
present, etc...

If you can do this, please let me know ASAP.  I'm going to send a
welcome/confirmation message to Chang, and I'd like to give him your
contact information and tell him to work with you if he has any
questions, etc.  Does that work?

>>     so immediately!  Marcia, what should I include as an RSVP date?
[...]
>How about some time spent on the proposed changes to WG chair roles.

At this point in time, I am not sure that we have any active proposals
to change the WG chair roles.  The PROTO team is starting to work on
some experiments, and we're planning to talk about that in the Gen Area
meeting.  I guess it wouldn't hurt to cover that stuff here, too, since
there are a lot of WG chairs who will miss the Gen Area meeting.  I'll
talk to Allison (my PROTO team co-leader) to see if she is willing/able
to do that.

>A note on this.  The web site keeps the old versions visible on the home 
>page as well as the newest ones.  While I think it is good to keep an 
>archive of the older stuff, I think it might be confusing to have it 
>appear on the home page.

Well, it confused me!

If we keep the old versions, they should be in a hard-to-find corner
labled "Old version of training materials" or something like that.
The new materials should be the only ones you get if you follow the
like for "Editors training" (or whatever) and click on the link to
view the materials.

James, could you do a bit of reorganization to make this clearer?  It
might help to move the "news" section off of the front page and get
the different training types (Newcomer's, WG Chairs, Editors, etc.) more
front-and-center on the main page.

Margaret

---

From: [email-masked]
Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2004 00:03:54 +0900

On 14 feb 2004, at 23.48, Margaret Wasserman wrote:

> (soon, in case he is trying to do any sort
> of translation of the slides),

I don't think he has any intention of doing this.  and he is very 
comfortable with English so has not need to do any prior translation 
for himself.  Also, I believe he is planning to attend the English 
version of the class and has gone over a tape of Scott's last 
presentation.

Spencer, if you are in Saturday evening and willing, I can introduce 
you Chang.  He and I were planning to get together some time in the 
late afternoon or evening to go over any last minute issues he might 
have.

a.

---

From: [email-masked]
Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2004 00:10:14 +0900

On 14 feb 2004, at 23.48, Margaret Wasserman wrote:

> to change the WG chair roles.

Ok, but you probably will during the year (or am I expecting things to 
move too quickly).    And if not, the idea will hold until 2006 or 
whenever.

> The PROTO team is starting to work on

And the idea might extend not only to Proto stuff but to other changes 
that will be rippling through the IETF in the next year or two.

The point I am really trying to make is that I think the edu part has 
to go hand in hand with any changes you all make.   Edu is a way to 
make sure that as many people as possible understand the changes, and 
that understanding will hopefully help the changes actually work in the 
way intended

a.

---

From: Margaret Wasserman <[email-masked]>
Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2004 10:29:28 -0500

At 12:10 AM 2/15/2004 +0900, [email-masked] wrote:
>move too quickly).    And if not, the idea will hold until 2006 or whenever.

Yes, we should definitely have plans for changes by the middle of the year --
we're working to spin up several experiments now, and we hope to be making
some real changes by San Diego.

>The point I am really trying to make is that I think the edu part has to 
>go hand in hand with any changes you all make.   Edu is a way to make sure 
>that as many people as possible understand the changes, and that 
>understanding will hopefully help the changes actually work in the way intended

Definitely!  All of our plans depend on the EDU team to train WG Chairs and
other participants on the new processes, etc.  It is probably too early,
at the moment, to start training on the changes, but we should already be
building the infrastructure (training sessions, web sites, etc.) that will
allow us to do that effectively when the time comes.

Margaret

---

From: "Spencer Dawkins" <[email-masked]>
Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2004 23:56:46 -0600

This looks like a plan to me. I can go to the Korean-language training
for an hour.

Also - Scott's slides need to be updated (not "changed", just looking
for things like Randy Bush is no longer on IESG), so I'll do this and
send the updated slides to ChangJoon. I am in town on Saturday night,
staying at the Lotte, so let's plan on me and Avri hooking up with
ChangJoon.

Spencer

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Margaret Wasserman" <[email-masked]>
To: <[email-masked]>
Cc: <[email-masked]>
Sent: Saturday, February 14, 2004 8:48 AM
Subject: Re: [edu-team] Seoul is Approaching Quickly!

> I'm just furiously busy until Seoul... So, it would be great if you
could

Tell me about it - I feel like I'm on the IESG! but I'm not - so,
sure...

> questions, etc.  Does that work?

Works for me. Please give him [email-masked] and +1 469 330
3616, for questions before Seoul, and let him know I'm in the Hotel
Lotte, starting Saturday night.

> >How about some time spent on the proposed changes to WG chair
roles.

Heh, heh, heh... have you thought about asking for feedback from the
WG chairs on
http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-klensin-process-july14-00.txt
and
http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-klensin-process-planb-00.txt?

---

From: Margaret Wasserman <[email-masked]>
Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2004 08:20:32 -0500

Hi Spencer,

Thanks!

The IESG and IAB slates were announced yesterday (or maybe Friday),
so please make sure that you get the latest information on the
slides.

I will assume that you and Avri will work together to make sure that
Chang gets any help that he needs.  Let me know if you need
anything from me.

Margaret

---

From: "Spencer Dawkins" <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2004 07:07:45 -0600

I am sending my slides along, so I won't be the bottleneck.

I did run into a couple of questions while updating the Newcomer's
Orientation slides -

- slide 6 says " working on liaison statement process" - is this still
true? Have we finished one? Is there a pointer to a draft? searching
for "Liasion " didn't show one on the IETF I-D search page.

- slide 7 - I tried to show what is "part of" the IETF that we talk
about, and what is "closely tied to" the IETF, but I can't find a
source that allows me to check this picture for accuracy. If I got it
wrong, please let me know!

- slide 10 - I KNOW I've seen a web page that shows IAB workshops, but
can't find it on IAB.org and can't find any current I-Ds reporting on
IAB workshops. Does anyone know where this information lives? or what
the subject of the most recent IAB workshop was?

- slide 16 - do I remember that ISOC is now also funding the
secretariat? based on .org registry revenues?

- slide 27 - added "IETF community review" to standards track
submission (is this what we've been doing wrong? :-)

- slides 33/34 - I'm not aware of any AD changes since Randy was
replaced, but can't find an announcement of the NomCom recommendations
for 2004 anywhere - that's the only change that's shown on the meeting
agenda page - is this right?

- I added ONE slide, on training that's taking place at this IETF.

Spencer

---

From: [email-masked] (Scott Bradner)
Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2004 09:40:35 -0500 (EST)

>> still working on it - not yet done

>> not yet - that might happen as a result of the reorg proposals
>> but its not happening now

>> :-)

>> http://www1.ietf.org/mail-archive/ietf-announce/Current/msg28631.html

---

From: Harald Tveit Alvestrand <[email-masked]>
Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2004 20:42:18 -0800

trying to catch up here too, thought I'd drop in some answers....

> for "Liasion " didn't show one on the IETF I-D search page.

draft-iab-liaison-mgt-01
draft-baker-liaison-statements-00

not yet finished.

> wrong, please let me know!

tough issue. see draft-iab-advcomm-report, RFC 3233 / BCP 58 "Defining the 
IETF".

> secretariat? based on .org registry revenues?

ISOC is not. It's one of the problems identified in the advcomm report that 
these two budgets seem to have a wall between them.
> agenda page - is this right?

Scott Hollenbeck is taking over from Ned Freed in Seoul.