Subject: "IFax" nomenclature

From: Dave Crocker <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 17 Sep 1998 13:18:04 +0100

we have an interesting dilemma that has been noted:  

	The term "ifax" has become quite popular but it is trademarked.

	This suggests we need a new term (sigh).

This sort of thing always seems a painful and even unnecessary exercise.
The problem is that the holder of a trademark is obligated to be rather
forceful (i.e., obnoxious) in aggressively defending against mis-use of the
mark.  That could be rather distracting for our new Internet Fax market.
Hence, there is some real benefit in doing work now, that will avoid that
distraction.

For the specifications done in this working group, it would perhaps be
reasonable to use the term: 

	FMail

Reactions and other suggestions are eagerly sought.

d/

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From: Richard Shockey <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 17 Sep 1998 12:43:23 -0500

>	This suggests we need a new term (sigh).

Really .. but Ifax could be defended if there is sufficient evidence of
prior use in the public domain. i.e use on this list prior to the
registration of the trademark etc. Under those conditions the trademark
could be challenged.  But there is no reason to go into legal
"hairsplitting" here .. there is certainly enough of that to go around
these days.

>Reactions and other suggestions are eagerly sought.

Well

EFax - electronic / enhanced Fax ?

MFax for Mail Fax ?

EMFax ? Electronic Mail Fax 

MPFax Mail Protocol Fax..

RNFax ... for Really Neet Fax

Now you could go the acronym route

FOAM   - Facsimile Over Advanced Mail

or 

FAME  Facsimile And Mail Extensions

there are lots of ways here to waste an afternoon!!

Richard Shockey
Shockey Consulting LLC                  
8045 Big Bend Blvd. Suite 110    
St. Louis, MO 63119
Voice 314.918.9020
Fax   314.918.9015
INTERNET Mail & IFAX : [email-masked]  
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From: Geoff Marshall <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 17 Sep 1998 20:50:30 -0400

IFax trademark dates from 1988 or possibly even 84, cannot quite recall
which.

Geoff

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From: Dave Crocker <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 17 Sep 1998 20:59:09 +0100

>prior use in the public domain. i.e use on this list prior to the

Yes, we could all spend energy on pursuing that sort of issue.  I doubt it
will be productive.

From the first time I heard the term ifax, I was told it was already
trademarked.  My recollection is hardly definitive, but it doesn't make one
sanguine about the outcome of an effort to dislodge the trademark claim.

>could be challenged.  But there is no reason to go into legal

we are in agreement.
>EFax - electronic / enhanced Fax ?

I rather like your first effort.

d/

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From: Claudio Allocchio +39 040 3758523 <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 18 Sep 1998 09:21:58 +0100

> 	This suggests we need a new term (sigh).

... well at least I was lucky not to use "ifax" nor in RFC2303, RFC2304 and
DRAFT-IETF-FAX-FULLADDR-04.TXT

;-)

Is also "I-fax" trademarked? it could be an escape solution ...

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From: Richard Shockey <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 18 Sep 1998 10:01:43 -0500

>Is also "I-fax" trademarked? it could be an escape solution ...

Claudio, punctuation is not considered sufficient. "I-Fax" would be
considered too close to Ifax and run into problems.

However if it slips into common use .. the owner of the "IFAX" trademark is
actually required by several court rulings to defend the use of the term as
a trademark in the public sphere.

The problem has come up in the fax and copier industries... the use of
"FaxBack" and "Xerox" as nouns in general usage has required both companies
to go to great lengths and cost to remind folks that the words are
trademarked and can be only used in conjunction with the products and
technologies manufactured by those companies.

That is just a side bar.. Dave is entirely correct ...the sooner we do a
word search and replace on the Drafts the better off we will be.

Richard Shockey
Shockey Consulting LLC

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From: Geoff Marshall <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 18 Sep 1998 11:04:59 -0400

Claudio wrote

>Is also "I-fax" trademarked? 

I believe not

Personaly, I like this one. I-Fax

I do not recall the trademark category in which IFax was originaly
registered, nor if it was registered under more than one category. I
believe that the description included 'fax equipment' and 'parts for fax
equipment'. If IFax was registered in only one category it may be
possible to use it anyway provided 'Internet Facsimile' can be
attributed to a different category. In the same category I-Fax would
almost certainly be considered too close to IFax, in a non-conflicting
category it should be OK. 

Geoff

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From: Tony Hansen <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 18 Sep 1998 15:45:34 -0400

> >EFax - electronic / enhanced Fax ?

Unfortunately, Efax is also registered. I've been told that my company wanted
to use that term a number of years ago for our "Enhanced Fax" service platform,
but couldn't.

Anyone know of any problems with "intfax"?

    Tony Hansen
    [email-masked]

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From: [email-masked] (George Pajari)
Date: Fri, 18 Sep 1998 14:09:49 -0700 (PDT)

> I rather like your first effort.

The parallel with EMail is compelling.

-- 
regards
g.

George.Pajari @ Faximum.COM  * Director of Engineering * Faximum Software Inc.
Faximum Messaging Server -> Fax/Email Integration * http://www.faximum.com/fms

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From: Richard Shockey <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 18 Sep 1998 16:53:26 -0500

>Anyone know of any problems with "intfax"?

I love it ... 

I'm starting to lean towards  "IFAT"  for Internet Facsimile Application
Transaction... It just came to me this morning as I was standing on my
bathroom scale...sorry its Friday.<g>

Richard Shockey
Shockey Consulting LLC