Subject: [Gen-art] Gen-ART Telechat review of draft-worley-service-example-13.txt

From: Suresh Krishnan <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 8 Oct 2013 09:56:01 -0400

I have been selected as the General Area Review Team (Gen-ART) reviewer
for this draft (for background on Gen-ART, please see
http://www.alvestrand.no/ietf/gen/art/gen-art-FAQ.html).

Please wait for direction from your document shepherd or AD before
posting a new version of the draft.

Document: draft-worley-service-example-13.txt
Reviewer: Suresh Krishnan
Review Date: 2013/10/08
IESG Telechat date: 2013/10/10

Summary: This draft is ready for publication as an Informational RFC but
I do have a few comments that the authors may wish to consider.

Minor
=====

* Please add an IANA considerations section to the draft stating that
the draft requires no IANA actions.

Enhancement request
===================

* Maybe it is too much to ask, but it would be great if the mailing list
references contained an URL to the archive as it is easier to get the
right mail. I leave it upto your discretion if you want to do this or not.

e.g.

For
   [kyzivat-2]
              Kyzivat, P., "[Sip-implementors] draft-worley-service-
              example-02", sip-implementors mailing list 020426,
              September 2008.

add

https://lists.cs.columbia.edu/pipermail/sip-implementors/2008-September/020426.html

---

From: Jari Arkko <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 10 Oct 2013 00:22:00 +0300

Thanks for your review, Suresh. I have balloted a no-objection, but would also like to hear from the authors if they have seen Suresh's comments below. Have you?

Jari

On Oct 8, 2013, at 4:56 PM, Suresh Krishnan <[email-masked]> wrote:

> _______________________________________________
> Gen-art mailing list
> [email-masked]
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/gen-art

---

From: [email-masked] (Dale R. Worley)
Date: Fri, 11 Oct 2013 17:51:31 -0400 (EDT)

> From: Suresh Krishnan <[email-masked]>

> Enhancement request

This draft is prepared using XML2RFC, and the XML source provides a
link.  E.g.,

    <reference anchor="kyzivat-2">
    <!-- Kyzivat's e-mail #2 -->
	<front>
	    <title>[Sip-implementors] draft-worley-service-example-02</title>
	    <author initials="P." surname="Kyzivat"><organization/></author>
	    <date month="September" year="2008"/>
	</front>
	<seriesInfo name="sip-implementors mailing list" value="020426" />
	<format type="TXT"
		target="https://lists.cs.columbia.edu/pipermail/sip-implementors/2008-September/020426.html" />
    </reference>

The text form does not contain the link:

   [kyzivat-2]

Much stranger, the HTML form does not either:

    http://svn.resiprocate.org/rep/ietf-drafts/worley/draft-worley-service-example-14.html

    <tr>
      <td class="reference">
        <b id="kyzivat-2">[kyzivat-2]</b>
      </td>
      <td class="top"><a>Kyzivat, P.</a>, "<a>[Sip-implementors] draft-worley-service-example-02</a>", sip-implementors mailing list 020426, September 2008.</td>
    </tr>

On the other hand, the HTML form does give links for the RFCs.  and
the XML source for those references is not much different:

    http://xml.resource.org/public/rfc/bibxml/reference.RFC.3261.xml

    <?xml version='1.0' encoding='UTF-8'?>

    <reference anchor='RFC3261'>

    <front>
    <title>SIP: Session Initiation Protocol</title>
    <author initials='J.' surname='Rosenberg' fullname='J. Rosenberg'>
    <organization /></author>
    <author initials='H.' surname='Schulzrinne' fullname='H. Schulzrinne'>
    <organization /></author>
    <author initials='G.' surname='Camarillo' fullname='G. Camarillo'>
    <organization /></author>
    <author initials='A.' surname='Johnston' fullname='A. Johnston'>
    <organization /></author>
    <author initials='J.' surname='Peterson' fullname='J. Peterson'>
    <organization /></author>
    <author initials='R.' surname='Sparks' fullname='R. Sparks'>
    <organization /></author>
    <author initials='M.' surname='Handley' fullname='M. Handley'>
    <organization /></author>
    <author initials='E.' surname='Schooler' fullname='E. Schooler'>
    <organization /></author>
    <date year='2002' month='June' />
    <abstract>
    <t>This document describes Session Initiation Protocol (SIP), an application-layer control (signaling) protocol for creating, modifying, and terminating sessions with one or more participants.  These sessions include Internet telephone calls, multimedia distribution, and multimedia conferences. [STANDARDS-TRACK]</t></abstract></front>

    <seriesInfo name='RFC' value='3261' />
    <format type='TXT' octets='647976' target='http://www.rfc-editor.org/rfc/rfc3261.txt' />
    </reference>

The ideal solution would be to update XML2RFC to show the provided
links.

In a more reasonable time frame, probably the best thing to do is have
the RFC Editor add the link to the references.

Dale

---

From: Richard Barnes <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 14 Oct 2013 10:37:02 +0300

This sounds like something we could take up with the RFC Editor?

On Sat, Oct 12, 2013 at 12:51 AM, Dale R. Worley <[email-masked]> wrote:

>             <author initials="P."
> surname="Kyzivat"><organization/></author>
>                 target="
> https://lists.cs.columbia.edu/pipermail/sip-implementors/2008-September/020426.html"
> />
>     </reference>
>
>       <td class="top"><a>Kyzivat, P.</a>, "<a>[Sip-implementors]
> draft-worley-service-example-02</a>", sip-implementors mailing list 020426,
> September 2008.</td>
>     </tr>
>
>     <t>This document describes Session Initiation Protocol (SIP), an
> application-layer control (signaling) protocol for creating, modifying, and
> terminating sessions with one or more participants.  These sessions include
> Internet telephone calls, multimedia distribution, and multimedia
> conferences. [STANDARDS-TRACK]</t></abstract></front>
>
>     <format type='TXT' octets='647976' target='
> http://www.rfc-editor.org/rfc/rfc3261.txt' />
>     </reference>
>

---

From: Suresh Krishnan <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2013 11:07:22 -0400

Hi Dale/Richard,
  Thanks for the quick response. I am happy with the RFC editor manual
edit solution. I was just playing around with the xml and I found that
the following formulation of the reference *does* provide the URL in the
text and the html versions. I used

<reference anchor="kyzivat-2"
target="https://lists.cs.columbia.edu/pipermail/sip-implementors/2008-September/020426.html">

instead of the current

<reference anchor="kyzivat-2">
...
<format type="TXT"
target="https://lists.cs.columbia.edu/pipermail/sip-implementors/2008-September/020426.html"
/>

Thanks
Suresh

On 10/14/2013 03:37 AM, Richard Barnes wrote:
> On Sat, Oct 12, 2013 at 12:51 AM, Dale R. Worley <[email-masked]
> <mailto:[email-masked]>> wrote:
> 
>     > From: Suresh Krishnan <[email-masked]
>     <mailto:[email-masked]>>
> 
>     > Enhancement request
>     > ===================
>     >
>     draft-worley-service-example-02</a>", sip-implementors mailing list
>     020426, September 2008.</td>
>         </tr>
> 
>     application-layer control (signaling) protocol for creating,
>     modifying, and terminating sessions with one or more participants.
>      These sessions include Internet telephone calls, multimedia
>     distribution, and multimedia conferences.
>     [STANDARDS-TRACK]</t></abstract></front>
> 
>         <format type='TXT' octets='647976'
>     target='http://www.rfc-editor.org/rfc/rfc3261.txt' />
>         </reference>
>

---

From: [email-masked] (Dale R. Worley)
Date: Wed, 16 Oct 2013 13:58:41 -0400 (EDT)

> the draft requires no IANA actions.

Of the 972 RFCs numbered from 6000 to 6999, 495 are "Standards Track".
Of those, 394 have an "IANA Considerations" section and 101 do not.

So at this point, it seems to me that the convention is that an "IANA
Considerations" section is not needed if there are no IANA
considerations.  If I get pushback from the IESG on this, I'll revise
my position.

Dale

---

From: [email-masked] (Dale R. Worley)
Date: Wed, 16 Oct 2013 15:40:18 -0400 (EDT)

> target="https://lists.cs.columbia.edu/pipermail/sip-implementors/2008-September/020426.html"

Yes, I'd tried the "target" attribute of the "reference" element and
it didn't work for me.  But yesterday I discovered that the failure
was due to an error in how I was running XML2RFC.  I've updated the
draft to use the "target" attribute, and now the HTML version has
links.  The text version has references like this:

   [kyzivat-1]
              Kyzivat, P., "Subject: Re: [Sipping] I-D ACTION:draft-
              ietf-sipping-service-examples-11.txt", IETF Sipping
              mailing list msg12181, October 2006, <http://www1.ietf.org
              /mail-archive/web/sipping/current/msg12181.html>.

   [kyzivat-2]
              Kyzivat, P., "[Sip-implementors] draft-worley-service-
              example-02", sip-implementors mailing list 020426,
              September 2008, <http://lists.cs.columbia.edu/pipermail/
              sip-implementors/2008-September/020426.html>.

Dale

---

From: [email-masked] (Dale R. Worley)
Date: Mon, 21 Oct 2013 18:09:01 -0400 (EDT)

> From: [email-masked] (Dale R. Worley)
> 

It turns out I'm wrong on that.  The "Document Lifecycle Tutorial"
(http://www.ietf.org/edu/documents/82DocumentLifecycleTutorial-Hagens.pdf)
page 27 states that an IANA Considerations section is required in all
drafts.  This is to ensure that all draft authors consider whether
there are any IANA considerations.  (A "No IANA Considerations"
section will be removed by the RFC Editor.)

I've updated the draft to insert an IANA Considerations section.

Dale

---

From: Suresh Krishnan <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 23 Oct 2013 09:58:59 -0400

Hi Dale,

> I've updated the draft to insert an IANA Considerations section.

Thanks Dale. With this change both my comments have been addressed. I am
guessing the changes would be reflected in version -15.

Cheers
Suresh