Subject: [Ltru] Re: extlang again

From: Frank Ellermann <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 02 Jun 2005 04:57:53 +0200

John Cowan wrote:

> Under what circumstances is nds referred to simply as
> "Deutsch", unqualified?

The German words for nds are "plattdeutsch", "platt", or very
artificially "niederdeutsch" (nieder ~ lower).  In contrast
"hochdeutsch" (hoch ~ upper) excludes nds and dialects.  There
is no doubt that nds is a language of its own, in at least one
German state they have a "platt" version of their constitution
together with de and dk versions.  But no fy as far as I know.

> Alemannisch, Bayerisch

AFAIK considered as dialects.

> North and East Frisian and Saterfrisian

AFAIK North == East.

> Kölsch

Considered as dialect (that doesn't imply that everybody could
understand it, spoken or written, it's only not considered as
language, i.e. you won't learn it in school etc.)

> Jenisch

That might be dead, but I'm not sure.

> Limburgisch

In Germany ?  That would surprise me, we have something called
"Oelscher Platt" ("Aachener Platt"), and "Moselfraenkisch",
the latter is probably the same or similar to...

> Letzeburgesch

> Mainfränkisch, Pfälzisch

Again dialects.

> Plautdietsch

Some "platt deutsch" version exported centuries ago to the US.

> Upper Saxon, Schwäbisch, Westfälisch

More dialects.

> Danish, Polish, Upper and Lower Sorbian

Polish as a "language used in Germany" is an obscure idea based
on German borders of 1914 and/or Polish immigration in the 19th
century.  Today tr is very important.

> three kinds of Romani

Are you sure about three, or is the third Jenisch ?  Bye, Frank

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From: Frank Ellermann <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 02 Jun 2005 05:07:36 +0200

Peter Constable wrote:

> Let's imagine that on average each is written with three
> different scripts, spoken in five countries, and that five
> variant subtags are eventually registered -- an *extreme*
> unlikelihood; that's around 53000 possible tags involving
> these extlangs.

Yes, when I said "billions" I wasn't talking about the number
of possible combinations, but the real ar-shu (etc.) tags in
"billions" of tagged documents (Web pages, mails, whatever).

                     Bye, Frank