Subject: mboned: upping a level on address discovery

From: Pekka Savola <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 11 Nov 2005 21:39:16 +0200 (EET)

Hi,

Now that the topic has resurfaced, I'd encourage folks considering 
solutions in this problem space take a look at
draft-ietf-mboned-addrdisc-problems-00.txt and consider the following:

  1) which category (currently 4) of the solution framework the idea is
     addressing? (or is it something new?)

  2) any particular comments whether that category has been well
     described?

  3) how would you reflect the proposal to the high level problem
     statement (section 2), in particular, the following:

    NOTE: David Meyer's experience from being the designated expert for
    IANA assignments is that almost all of the requested multicast
    addresses have been such that the requestors would not have been
    satisfied if their application would only be restricted to operate
    within a site.

    If people agree on this, the first three mitigation techniques won't
    have significant impact, because the application developers won't
    implement the discovery in any case.  They will _still_ want to get
    the globally scoped addresses from IANA, instead of implementing the
    "service discovery inside an organization" -shim.

-- 
Pekka Savola                 "You each name yourselves king, yet the
Netcore Oy                    kingdom bleeds."
Systems. Networks. Security. -- George R.R. Martin: A Clash of Kings
_______________________________________________________________
user interface: http://darkwing.uoregon.edu/~llynch/mboned.html
web archive:  http://darkwing.uoregon.edu/~llynch/mboned/

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From: Marshall Eubanks <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 11 Nov 2005 15:00:41 -0500

Hello;

>    satisfied if their application would only be restricted to operate

Then I do not understand why they are not applying for eGlop space,  
and why
IANA is not requiring it. That is what
it's for. (I have offered several times, including on this list,
to assist this  effort if help is needed pushing the first  
application through.)

Regards
Marshall

---

From: Pekka Savola <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 11 Nov 2005 22:12:28 +0200 (EET)

On Fri, 11 Nov 2005, Marshall Eubanks wrote:
> and why IANA is not requiring it. That is what it's for. (I have 
> offered several times, including on this list, to assist this effort 
> if help is needed pushing the first application through.)

Is there a difference (particularly from the applicant's point of 
view) except on how many different people/organizations you have to 
talk to, how many documents you have to read, and potentially how much 
you have to pay?

eGLOP would be OK if it was set up and there would NOT be direct IANA 
assignment at all, but as it isn't and IANA hasn't closed the doors, 
why would anyone want to (try to) use that process?

---

From: Marshall Eubanks <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 11 Nov 2005 15:26:49 -0500

If IANA said, we are no longer in that business, you have to see so  
and so to do this,
then that would be that.

I can believe that some of the people who go to IANA for this might  
find this
daunting. I do not believe that none of them wouldn't make a good  
test case.

In any case, I think Beau's proposal is aimed more at the "hard  
coders" than the
much more resourceful set that go to IANA.

Regards
Marshall

On Nov 11, 2005, at 3:12 PM, Pekka Savola wrote:

>> Then I do not understand why they are not applying for eGlop  
>> space, and why IANA is not requiring it. That is what it's for. (I  
>> have offered several times, including on this list, to assist this  
>> effort if help is needed pushing the first application through.)
>
> talk to, how many documents you have to read, and potentially how  
> much you have to pay?
>
> eGLOP would be OK if it was set up and there would NOT be direct  
> IANA assignment at all, but as it isn't and IANA hasn't closed the  
> doors, why would anyone want to (try to) use that process?
>
> --

---

From: Marshall Eubanks <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 11 Nov 2005 15:51:44 -0500

Another thing that I have discussed is having some of us
applying for eGlop space, with the express intention of "assigning"  
this space
out to who-ever comes to IANA with a decent case.

Is there any support for this in the WG ? It might break that  
particular Gordian knot, and remove
this as a topic for discussion.

Regards
Marshall

On Nov 11, 2005, at 3:26 PM, Marshall Eubanks wrote:

>>> space, and why IANA is not requiring it. That is what it's for.  
>>> (I have offered several times, including on this list, to assist  
>>> this effort if help is needed pushing the first application  
>>> through.)
>>
>> view) except on how many different people/organizations you have  
>> to talk to, how many documents you have to read, and potentially  
>> how much you have to pay?
>>

---

From: David Meyer <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 11 Nov 2005 12:55:30 -0800

> to assist this  effort if help is needed pushing the first  

	We never found a RIR willing to take it on (which was
	kinda the point of eGLOP).

	Dave

---

From: Marshall Eubanks <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 11 Nov 2005 16:07:49 -0500

Dear Dave;

> 	kinda the point of eGLOP).

Ah, then that speaks for Plan B. I can be annoyingly persistent when
I want to...

Marshall