Subject: Re: [mmox] mmox Digest, Vol 1, Issue 111

From: "[email-masked]" <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 16:44:23 GMT

>My model can coexist with copyright-based models, provided I can
opt my content out of any DRM system.

With a DRM system like c/m/t being conveyed, you check off c/m/t if you want full perms to be distributed *shrugs*. That's all. Transporting the metadata of c/m/t -- or no c/m/t and demanding a regime to implement it does not preclude you from "opting out" by...checking off c/m/t. Why would you think that the act of having to check off c/m/t to get full perms, so that others who *do not* want to check them off and wish to make a living not through consulting but by object sales would somehow preclude your full-perms distribution? Makes no sense, again, except as an ideological demand.

There has been no scientific, peer-reviewed study of whether the 8 generatives really made a living for anyone already funded; it's one of those anecdotal things that a few people spread the memes, and it becomes an urban legend.

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From: Dan Olivares <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 12:44:49 -0500

Theres another datapoint to add to this.

As far as I know, the only other effort within the IETF with regards
to content protection was a working group called ietf-idrm which was
chartered to come up with a universally acceptable DRM scheme.

It had some big names including:
Eberhard Becker, University of Dortmund
Dan Boneh, Stanford University
Karlheinz Brandenburg, Fraunhofer Institute for Integrated Circuits
Leonardo Chiariglione, CSELT
Drew Dean, Xerox PARC
Joan Feigenbaum, Yale University
Edward Felten, Princeton University
Yair Frankel, eCash Technologies
Markus Jakobsson, Bell Labs
Paul Kocher, Cryptography Research
John Manferdelli, Microsoft Research
Kevin McCurley, IBM Research
Moni Naor, Weizmann Institute
Fabien Petitcolas, Microsoft Research
Pamela Samuelson, University of California, Berkeley
Hal Varian, University of California, Berkeley
Moti Yung, CertCo

Unfortunately, it was shut down in 2003 because nobody could
agree(http://www.pairlist.net/pipermail/ietf-idrm/2003-February.txt )
and eventually it became dormant.   From a cursory glance, the
archives seem to say that DRM means different things to different
people, and seems to be one of those topics where 'you can't please
everyone'.   It also seems to state that usually, today, DRM schemes
are 'licensed' technology and not 'standardized' because this allows
them to be a 'black box'.

In any case, it might be useful to look at the arguments from that RG(
Archive: http://www.pairlist.net/pipermail/ietf-idrm/ ) and see how we
can avoid a similar fate.

Best Regards

Dan

On Mon, Feb 23, 2009 at 11:44 AM, [email-masked]
<[email-masked]> wrote:
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From: Jesrad <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 23:01:32 +0100

I already do check c+m+t on my objects, but that does not prevent in
any way the next owner from unchecking them. That is what I mean by
"opting out" of the permission system. Just as a copyright-business
does not want people to be able to check the missing permissions, I do
not want them to be able to uncheck them, because it reduces the value
of what I sell and constitutes a violation of either my copyright (in
the copyright model) or a violation the further buyers' property
rights and fraud (in my model).

I do not know what the "8 generatives" refer to. All I know is that
I'm making money, that the permission system in SL makes my business
model wide open to a little but annoying amount of ripping off that
harms its value, and that I'd rather not have that situation extended
to all other VWs.

On Mon, Feb 23, 2009 at 5:44 PM, [email-masked]
<[email-masked]> wrote:
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