Subject: [dnsext] DNSEXT List Policy

From: Ólafur Guðmundsson /DNSEXT chair <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 19 Dec 2008 10:55:20 -0500

Periodic posting, updated 19/Dec/2008. (new note well statement)

List Purpose:

   namedroppers at ops.ietf.org is the mailing list for the IETF DNSEXT
   (DNS EXTensions) working group.

   See <http://www.ietf.org/html.charters/dnsext-charter.html> for the
   WG charter.  Messages should be on topics appropriate to the DNSEXT
   WG, which are various discussion of the DNS protocols or
   administrivia of the WG itself.

- Specific items that are not appropriate for posting

   Calls for papers, announcements of events not directly relevant to
   the DNS protocols, etc. are not appropriate.

   Discussion of problems with particular implementations,
   announcements of releases, sites' misconfiguration, pleas for help
   with specific implementations, etc.  should be done on mailing lists
   for the particular implementations.

   There is a working group for DNS operational practice, DNSOP, whose
   charter can be found at
   <http://www.ietf.org/html.charters/dnsop-charter.html>. Items
   relevant to the DNSOP charter are to be discussed on the DNSOP
   mailing list.

   Discussion about the quality of implementations is outside the scope
   of this list.

Moderation:

   Moderator: DNSEXT chair(s) unless otherwise announced on mailing list.

   Moderation is based on "subscriber-only with spam filter". To
   counter a certain class of spam mails, messages over 20000
   characters, originating from list subscribers, will be held for
   moderations.

   Questions or concerns related to the acceptance or rejection of
   specific messages to the namedroppers mailing list should first be
   discussed with the WG chair, with follow up appeals using the normal
   appeals process of RFC 2026 (i.e. follow up with area directors, then
   IESG, etc.).

Note Well

Any submission to the IETF intended by the Contributor for publication as all
or part of an IETF Internet-Draft or RFC and any statement made 
within the context
of an IETF activity is considered an "IETF Contribution". Such 
statements include
oral statements in IETF sessions, as well as written and electronic 
communications
made at any time or place, which are addressed to:
         - the IETF plenary session,
         - any IETF working group or portion thereof,
         - the IESG or any member thereof on behalf of the IESG,
         - the IAB or any member thereof on behalf of the IAB,
         - any IETF mailing list, including the IETF list itself, any 
working group
           or design team list, or any other list functioning under 
IETF auspices,
         - the RFC Editor or the Internet-Drafts function

All IETF Contributions are subject to the rules of RFC 5378 and RFC 
3979 (updated
by RFC 4879).

Statements made outside of an IETF session, mailing list or other function,
that are clearly not intended to be input to an IETF activity, group 
or function,
are not IETF Contributions in the context of this notice. Please consult
RFC 5378 and RFC 3979 for details.

A participant in any IETF activity is deemed to accept all IETF rules 
of process,
as documented in Best Current Practices RFCs and IESG Statements.

A participant in any IETF activity acknowledges that written, audio 
and video records of meetings may be made and may be available to the public.

---

From: Andrew Sullivan <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 19 Dec 2008 13:24:36 -0500

Dear colleagues,

On Fri, Dec 19, 2008 at 10:55:20AM -0500, Ólafur Guðmundsson /DNSEXT chair wrote:
> All IETF Contributions are subject to the rules of RFC 5378 and RFC 3979 
> (updated
> by RFC 4879).

We, the chairs, draw to your attention the above change to the
policies historically governing IETF contributions.  The rules under
RFC 5378 are different from the rights in contributions rules under
which we have been working.  We urge that participants in the working
group read RFC 5378 before making any contribution.  RFC 5378 makes
claims about what agreements individuals are deemed to have made by
virtue of their actions.  We urge participants to determine whether
they fall into the class of such individuals.
                                                                                
We also draw to your attention the Non-Exclusive License agreement
that the IETF Trust has on its web pages:
http://trustee.ietf.org/docs/Contributor_Non-Exclusive_License_RFC5378.pdf.

If you have ever contributed to the Working Group, we ask you to sign
that agreement and returned it to the IETF Trust.  We think
"contributed" means any contribution of any kind: posting to the
mailing list, speaking at the mic or even in the hallways to others at
IETF meetings about Working Group topics, or anything else.  It is not
restricted to being author of text included in a published RFC.  RFC
5378 defines "Contribution" this way:

   a. "Contribution": any submission to the IETF intended by the
      Contributor for publication as all or part of an Internet-Draft or
      RFC (except for RFC Editor Contributions described in Section 4
      below) and any statement made within the context of an IETF
      activity.  Such statements include oral statements in IETF
      sessions as well as written and electronic communications, made at
      any time or place, that are addressed to:

      o the IETF plenary session,
      o any IETF working group or portion thereof,
      o any Birds of a Feather (BOF) session,
      o the IESG, or any member thereof on behalf of the IESG,
      o the IAB, or any member thereof on behalf of the IAB,
      o any IETF mailing list, including the IETF list itself, any
        working group or design team list, or any other list functioning
        under IETF auspices,
      o the RFC Editor or the Internet-Drafts function (except for RFC
        Editor Contributions, as described in Section 4 below).

      Statements made outside of an IETF session, mailing list, or other
      function, that are clearly not intended to be input to an IETF
      activity, group, or function are not IETF Contributions in the
      context of this document.

   b. "Contributor": an individual submitting a Contribution.

RFC 5378 also requires Contributors (in the meaning of the document)
to agree that they have received the necessary permissions on
everything in their Contribution from anyone else with a right in any
of that Contribution.  (This is an imprecise way of saying it, and you
are encouraged to consult RFC 5378 for the specifics.)

In this working group, we deal with a protocol that has a long
history, and with lots of old text.  The most practical way for
Contributors to be able to assert that their Contribution can all be
covered by RFC 5378 is if such Contributors can prove that anything in
a Contribution has already been covered by RFC 5378.  So, refusing to
sign does not affect anything you say or do in the context of the
working group henceforth, but we think it will make easier the task of
incorporating old text in newer documents.

It is possible that the IESG will adopt a different procedure in the
future, and that the rules will change.  Unless and until that
happens, however, we believe it would be of benefit to your colleagues
(both in this working group and across the IETF) if you were willing
to sign the IETF Trust Non-exclusive License agreement.  Once it is
signed, it can be sent to

IETF Trust
1775 Wiehle Ave
Reston, VA 201905108
c/o IETF Administrative Director
Facsimile: 703.326.9881

The IAD has also stated (in
http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/ietf/current/msg54646.html) that
he's willing to take signed PDFs by email (<[email-masked]>).  We note
in passing that we chairs have both signed the agreement.

In closing, we also remind participants that the new IETF policies are
not the output of this working group, and that this working group is
not really the right venue to comment on whether the IETF policy is
the right one.  We also do not have the expertise to determine whether
the chairs are right to think that everyone signing the agreement will
be the best answer for the working group.  Since we chairs aren't
lawyers, we don't really know; but it looks like the best answer to
us.  Because of this, we ask that participants refrain from debating
the merits of the IETF policy or the agreement on the working group
list.  It is of course appropriate to discuss the operation of the
working group and the behaviour of the chairs, but please keep in mind
that we are merely making a request based on our best judgement, and
not making claims of fact about what is or is not covered under the
new rules.  Participants will have to decide for themselves whether
they should sign the agreement, and their own determinations as to
whether they meet the definition of Contributor of RFC 5378, and the
terms governing such Contributions.

Best regards,

Ólafur and Andrew

-- 
Andrew Sullivan
[email-masked]
Shinkuro, Inc.

--
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---

From: Andrew Sullivan <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 19 Dec 2008 13:43:54 -0500

Dear colleagues,

> http://trustee.ietf.org/docs/Contributor_Non-Exclusive_License_RFC5378.pdf.

Apparently, we spoke too soon.  The IAD has just posted a message that
the above form has been taken down, and that something new is
apparently on its way.  

Best regards,

Andrew (for the Chairs)

-- 
Andrew Sullivan
[email-masked]
Shinkuro, Inc.