Subject: RE: New Liaison Statement, "LS on ATSSS Phase 2 conclusions"

From: Apostolis Salkintzis <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 2 Dec 2020 09:13:52 +0000

Thank you Lionel.

Quick response to the question below:
“I wonder what this sentence means. Is it suggesting that UPF (and possibly UE) would buffer packets that arrive on the faster path until the packets that were sent on the slower path reach that node?”

Correct. Note, however, that how out-of-order delivery is achieved by protocol implementations is not considered by 3GPP SA2. 3GPP SA2 only assumes that the multipath protocol between the UE and UPF should be able to support out-of-order delivery.

Regards,
Apostolis

From: [email-masked] <[email-masked]>
Sent: Tuesday, December 1, 2020 9:14 PM
To: [email-masked]; [email-masked]
Cc: [email-masked]; [email-masked]; [email-masked]; [email-masked]; [email-masked]; [email-masked]; [email-masked]; [email-masked]; [email-masked]; [email-masked]; Apostolis Salkintzis <[email-masked]>
Subject: [External] RE: New Liaison Statement, "LS on ATSSS Phase 2 conclusions"

Including Apostolis into the loop.

De : [email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]> [mailto:[email-masked]]
Envoyé : mardi 1 décembre 2020 12:07
À : [email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]>; MORAND Lionel TGI/OLN <[email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]>>
Cc : [email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]>; [email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]>; [email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]>; [email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]>; [email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]>; [email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]>; [email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]>; [email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]>; [email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]>; [email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]>
Objet : RE: New Liaison Statement, "LS on ATSSS Phase 2 conclusions"

Thanks for raising this topic. With https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-amend-iccrg-multipath-reordering-01 we consider exactly that and try to provide input to develop/discuss different re-ordering strategies. My personal belief is, that without any re-ordering implementation in the UPF or UE the end-to-end delivery will be worse.

From: QUIC <[email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]>> On Behalf Of Kazuho Oku
Sent: Dienstag, 1. Dezember 2020 11:29
To: [email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]>
Cc: Magnus Westerlund <[email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]>>; Liaison Statement Management Tool <[email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]>>; [email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]>; [email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]>; [email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]>; Lucas Pardue <[email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]>>; Marten Seemann <[email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]>>; Lars Eggert <[email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]>>; QUIC Discussion List <[email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]>>; Martin Duke <[email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]>>
Subject: Re: New Liaison Statement, "LS on ATSSS Phase 2 conclusions"

Lionel, thank you for converting the statement to PDF.

Reading the document, I have one question.

"The simultaneous transmission of a data flow across two accesses should not result in out-of-order delivery"

I wonder what this sentence means. Is it suggesting that UPF (and possibly UE) would buffer packets that arrive on the faster path until the packets that were sent on the slower path reach that node? To give an example, let's say that UE has sent three packets: packet 1 sent using WiFi, packet 2 using LTE, packet 3 using WiFi. UPF receives packets in the order of 1, 3, 2. Is UPF expected to postpone the forwarding of packet 3 until it receives packet 2?

I raise the question, because during the interim, some have pointed out that such buffering has negative effects on loss recovery, and that we should devote our efforts to designing an end-to-end multi-path design, rather than having an intermediary that aggregates paths (in this case UPF).

2020年12月1日(火) 18:43 <[email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]>>:
Hi,

Here is a pdf version.

Regards,

Lionel

De : Marten Seemann [mailto:[email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]>]
Envoyé : mardi 1 décembre 2020 05:17
À : Liaison Statement Management Tool <[email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]>>
Cc : Lucas Pardue <[email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]>>; Lars Eggert <[email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]>>; Magnus Westerlund <[email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]>>; MORAND Lionel TGI/OLN <[email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]>>; [email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]>; [email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]>; [email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]>; QUIC Discussion List <[email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]>>; Martin Duke <[email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]>>
Objet : Re: New Liaison Statement, "LS on ATSSS Phase 2 conclusions"

Would it be possible to publish this document in a format that can be opened by everyone without using proprietary software?

Thank you,
Marten

On Mon, Nov 30, 2020 at 10:40 PM Liaison Statement Management Tool <[email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]>> wrote:
Title: LS on ATSSS Phase 2 conclusions
Submission Date: 2020-11-30
URL of the IETF Web page: https://datatracker.ietf.org/liaison/1710/

From: Susanna Kooistra <[email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]>>
To: Lars Eggert <[email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]>>,Lucas Pardue <[email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]>>
Cc: QUIC Discussion List <[email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]>>,Martin Duke <[email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]>>,Magnus Westerlund <[email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]>>,Lucas Pardue <[email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]>>,Lars Eggert <[email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]>>,[email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]>,[email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]>
Response Contacts: [email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]>,[email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]>
Technical Contacts:
Purpose: For information

Body:
Attachments:

    S2-2009400_8852r02
    https://www.ietf.org/lib/dt/documents/LIAISON/liaison-2020-11-30-3gpp-tsgsa-sa2-quic-ls-on-atsss-phase-2-conclusions-attachment-1.doc

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