Subject: RE: snmpconf To Do list items

From: "Wijnen, Bert (Bert)" <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2001 17:24:40 +0200

inline

> ----------
> From: 	Jon Saperia[SMTP:[email-masked]]
> Reply To: 	[email-masked]
> Sent: 	Wednesday, March 28, 2001 2:48 PM
> To: 	[email-masked]
> Subject: 	snmpconf To Do list items
> 
> Here are two additions, both may have been briefly brought up at the
> meeting.
> 
>         1. I think it was Bert that raised the question about more
> examples in the BCP. Is this correct? In either case we should probably
> add one or two to the BCP for the policy section as examples of good
> ways to use the system. I believe that Hongal can help with this.
> 
When the discussion came up about a simple and a complex example,
Brian Carpenter suggested that the example presented by Hongal
was far more complex then real life ISPs would want to do. He suggested
a simple """data from customer A" gets special threatment is a more
simpler and realistic example. So I suggested to do that one, but also
keep the one that Hongal presented.

Bert
>         2. Policy Termination - there have been extensive discussions
> about what to happen when a policy terminates. My recollection - with
> help from David - is that if one wants a policy reset after termination
> a lower precedence policy should be in the group that will take over. I
> have no issue with this as the resolution, only that we need to document
> that this is how this behavior is achieved.
> 
> 
> Thanks,
> /jon
> 
> --
> Jon Saperia		     [email-masked]
> 			     Phone: 617-744-1079
> 			     Fax:   617-249-0874
> 			     http://www.jdscons.com/
>

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From: Harrie Hazewinkel <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2001 14:39:56 -0800

> keep the one that Hongal presented.

There is already an example in the diffserv-policy draft.
It does not have a full-blown scripting example as would be used
in the policy-mib module, but I attempted to keep it as simple
as possible.

Therefore, I start to wonder where do we want to put the example
of Hongal. I don't think it is the policy-mib draft and the
diffserv-policy draft already has an example.
one thing that was good with the example of Hongal was how to
use vendor extensions, but that is IMHO a diffserv-example.

Just my thoughts of it. Cheers,

Harrie

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From: Jon Saperia <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 29 Mar 2001 09:58:58 -0500

Harrie, Bert, Hongal:

How would it be if we put a number of examples in the BCP in the section
that deals with policy. We could use the script as an example of how to
write a concise script for a fairly complicated system.

There are two a couple of other examples that should go in there as
well. We could reference the BCP in the other documents in such a way
that it is not a normative reference but something people could look
into if they wanted.

Is this OK?

/jon

Thanks,
/jon
--

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From: Harrie Hazewinkel <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 29 Mar 2001 08:31:17 -0800

> write a concise script for a fairly complicated system.

If you want to put it in the BCP, that is fine. However, I see one
problem
that is maybe a non-issue. The example has vendor extensions. That
means,
one should add the MIB module for the extensions in the BCP as well.
Otherwise, you just have half of an example.

Also when I looked at the example, there were some errors in it.
I admit I also made a few errors in mine, since the Diffserv MIB
is complicated. We must fix it before it goes in the BCP.

> that it is not a normative reference but something people could look

That is fine, refering to an example in an other document is
no problem and should be not a normative reference.

Harrie

---

From: Thippanna Hongal <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 29 Mar 2001 10:17:25 -0600

Comments In line:

Harrie

I do fix those when I write the example.,However I have a feeling that
the example should go in policy document , as BCP the name specifies
'Current Practice'.

I do not see a strong reason not to include this example
in the policy document considering the fact that this example is focused at

1.  An example policy description, rules and their equivalent
     'Filter' and 'Action' code segment.
2.  Action part shows how an vendor extension access function
     can be used to clone the data path template.
3.  How we populate  data in pmPolicyTable, pmRoleTable, ElementTable  tables.
4.  Off course I tried to visualize the cloning part with tables, which is 
only for the
      purpose to support the example, not to focus on theory of 
differentiated services.

  thanks
hongal

---

From: David Partain <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 30 Mar 2001 10:49:04 +0200

Hi,

Jon responded:
> How would it be if we put a number of examples in the BCP in
> the section that deals with policy. We could use the script
> as an example of how to write a concise script for a fairly
> complicated system.
> 
> There are two a couple of other examples that should go in there
> as well. We could reference the BCP in the other documents in
> such a way that it is not a normative reference but something
> people could look into if they wanted.

Hongal wrote:

> I do not see a strong reason not to include this example in
> the policy document considering the fact that this example is
> focused at
> 
> 4.  Of course I tried to visualize the cloning part with
> tables, which is only for the purpose to support the example,
> not to focus on theory of differentiated services.

I believe that Hongal's example would be extremely useful
and think that it should go in the diffserv policy MIB.
I do not think that it should be in the PM module since I
don't think we should have technology-specific examples there.
It's rather diffserv-specific, and it's very like the example
we already have in the diffserv policy MIB, so I'm not sure
that the BCP is the right place either, but I really don't have
a strong preference.  Two examples is certainly a good thing.

Cheers,

--
David Partain                  [email-masked]
Ericsson Radio Systems AB      Tel:    +46 13 28 41 44
Research and Innovation        Fax:    +46 13 28 75 67
P.O. Box 1248
SE-581 12  Linköping, Sweden

---

From: Jon Saperia <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 30 Mar 2001 08:01:01 -0500

For the history of this discussion, please see attached.

For the most part I agree with everything that David said except
exclusion of technology specific details in the PM. In the end every
policy is technology specific, even the RMON examples, so that is hard
to avoid. However:

On reflection, I think we may need a number of examples in a number of
documents. My view is that the goals should be:

           1. For the Policy MIB Module:

                 A. How to write effective and concise policy scripts -
                 The script portion of what Hongal wrote would be
                 great. I do see the desire not to get to technology
                 (Domain-Specific) in that document so the inclusion of
                 the DiffServ script would be just one example. There
                 probably should be others. There are already some
                 examples that Steve has provided to show portions of
                 how the language works.

                 B. How the Policy Module can use MIB Modules like the
                 DiffServ Policy Module since that makes a significant
                 simplification in the policy script.

                 C. An example of a policy that manipulates
                 instance-specific MIB objects directly. There are
                 already some others would not hurt.

           2. For the DiffServ Policy Module:

                  A. Basic examples and how the module is used with the
                  DiffServ Module. Hongals example does a great job of
                  this.

                  B. Use of the DiffServ and DiffServ Policy Modules
                  without the benefit of the Policy Module. This can
                  show the flexibility of the system we have created.

                  C. Use of the PM and the DiffServ PM and the DiffServ
                  MIB in combination. Again Hongals piece does a good
                  job.

                  D. Use of the DiffServ PM with Implementation specific
                  extensions such as the ones in Hongal's example. We
                  would also want to point out or to the instance
                  specific counterparts so people understand how all the
                  pieces work - this is a part of Hongals example that
                  might benefit from expansion.

           3. In the BCP (the policy section) we can be a bit more broad
           so we could have a wide variety of scripts and real or
           imaginary MIB objects as examples. I see no reason to limit
           the scope (other than time/cost benefit) of the examples in
           the BCP.

Summary:

        A. We probably want to add one or two more simple examples to
        the PM Document. It does not harm to use DiffServ as one of
        them, though we probably should just focus on his since script
        slide.

        B. As much as possible of Hongals work with as much detail
        should go in the DiffServ PM since that is the best exposition
        on this work I have seen and is relevant to the DiffServ PM.

        C. Other examples should go in the BCP as time permits.

/jon

Thanks,
/jon
--