Subject: [TICTOC] Requirements draft - call for assistance

From: Yaakov Stein <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 18 Sep 2008 08:20:38 +0300

Hi all,

Yesterday the chairs and Silvana, who is co-editor of the requirements draft,
discussed the progress of this draft.

The requirements draft tries to cover quite a number of areas for which timing is relevant,
and while there has been significant participation from the cellular and TDM PW communities,
there has been inadequate input on most of the other areas.

In particular, for the areas
   * industrial applications
   * test and measurement
   * electric power and teleprotection
we have no data other than that "pulled out of the air" at the Paris meeting,
and no one has expressed interest in providing insights into their requirements.

On the one hand TICTOC needs to consider all of the applications that will need to distribute timing,
but on the other hand if groups with interest in particular applications do not join in the effort,
we will not be able to produce a meaningful document.

Please consider this email as a call for participation for the aforementioned areas.
If you are working or interested in them, please send an email to the list.
If you know people who are, please forward this email to them.

If we do not receive input that we believe reliably reflects the requirements of these areas,
we will have to drop them from the document, and thus remove them from consideration
while working on solutions.

Y(J)S

_______________________________________________
TICTOC mailing list
[email-masked]
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tictoc

---

From: "FERRANT JEAN-LOUP" <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 18 Sep 2008 08:19:52 +0200

Yaakov,
 
As you just reminded us, these areas have been named during a kind of brainstorming session, without real justification of their need. If we do not receive soon any proof of interest, I support your proposal  to remove these areas from the document  and I propose to do it at the next meeting.
 
Regards
 
Jean-Loup

________________________________

De : [email-masked] [mailto:[email-masked]] De la part de Yaakov Stein
Envoyé : jeudi 18 septembre 2008 07:21
À : [email-masked]
Objet : [TICTOC] Requirements draft - call for assistance

Hi all, 

 

 
 
Y(J)S

---

From: [email-masked]
Date: Thu, 18 Sep 2008 00:44:01 -0700

Hi Yaakov,

I can comment on the electric power and instrumentation bit. Each power
grid sub-station has a large number of monitoring devices. These devices
historically have been served time via IRIG-B distributed time systems. The
substations will typically have a gps receiver for time and 1pps to drive
the IRIG generators. the backhaul networks are usually private circuit
based networks. In past years many of these were on SNA or some other
similar network. As these substations are upgraded they are being
implemented with local LAN's and will have time distribution systems based
on 1588 or ntp. This allows the removal of the IRIG systems. The backhaul
networks can then be migrated to packet based with whatever access makes
sense for each location. The time distribution systems are local to the
substations.

In test and measurement the LXI forum, LAN extensions for Instrumentation,
has mandated the use of 1588 for compliance. Again this is a local time
distribution paradigm with a local time source.

Many of the "time" based event correlation systems use a local source of
time, typically gps, for time stamps. This is then sent in non-real time to
the monitoring systems for overall system correlation processing. I agree
with your thought that most of these are not applicable to the TICTOC work.

Hopefully this info is helpful.

Pat

             Yaakov Stein                                                  
             <[email-masked]                                             
             >                                                          To 
             Sent by:                  "[email-masked]" <[email-masked]> 
             tictoc-bounces@ie                                          cc 
             tf.org                                                        
                                                                   Subject 
                                       [TICTOC] Requirements draft - call  
             09/17/2008 10:21          for assistance                      
             PM                                                            

Hi all,

Yesterday the chairs and Silvana, who is co-editor of the requirements
draft,
discussed the progress of this draft.

The requirements draft tries to cover quite a number of areas for which
timing is relevant,
and while there has been significant participation from the cellular and
TDM PW communities,
there has been inadequate input on most of the other areas.

In particular, for the areas
   * industrial applications
   * test and measurement
   * electric power and teleprotection
we have no data other than that "pulled out of the air" at the Paris
meeting,
and no one has expressed interest in providing insights into their
requirements.

On the one hand TICTOC needs to consider all of the applications that will
need to distribute timing,
but on the other hand if groups with interest in particular applications do
not join in the effort,
we will not be able to produce a meaningful document.

Please consider this email as a call for participation for the
aforementioned areas.
If you are working or interested in them, please send an email to the list.
If you know people who are, please forward this email to them.

If we do not receive input that we believe reliably reflects the
requirements of these areas,
we will have to drop them from the document, and thus remove them from
consideration
while working on solutions.

Y(J)S