Subject: IETF Logo Wear

From: IETF Administrative Director <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 16 Aug 2010 08:26:53 -0700 (PDT)

All;

At the request of the community the IAOC and the IETF Trust have approved
the establishment of an online store from which the community can buy IETF
logo wear.

The store is at CafePress at:  http://www.cafepress.com/ietf

The store is maintained by the Internet Society and is expected to
generate a very modest income, which will be used to offset IETF
operational expenses.

Suggestions for products or designs may be directed to Steve Conte,
[email-masked].

Shouldn't everyone in your family have an IETF logo wear t-shirt?

Ray Pelletier
IAD

---

From: Fred Baker <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 16 Aug 2010 14:20:22 -0700

There's no place like ::1

On Aug 16, 2010, at 2:01 PM, Philip Nesser wrote:

> We obviously need an IETF branded one of these:  http://www.cafepress.com/+theres_127001_infant_bodysuit,111188172
> 
> 
> --->  Phil
> 
> 
> On Mon, Aug 16, 2010 at 8:26 AM, IETF Administrative Director <[email-masked]> wrote:
> All;
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ietf mailing list
> [email-masked]
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ietf mailing list
> [email-masked]
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf

---

From: Fred Baker <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 16 Aug 2010 14:30:55 -0700

or http://www.pdphoto.org/PictureDetail.php?mat=&pg=7634

---

From: Sean Turner <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 16 Aug 2010 18:09:04 -0400

I like:

"Be conservative in what you send and liberal in what you accept"
      Jon Postel

I'm sure somebody who has been around longer than me can offer up a 
date ;)

spt

---

From: Fred Baker <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 16 Aug 2010 15:34:02 -0700

IEN 111, August 1979. The preface reads:

This document describes the Internet Protocol.  There have been three
previous editions of this specification, and the present text draws
heavily from them.  There have been many contributors to this document
both in terms of concepts and in terms of text.

                                                           Jon Postel
                                                           Editor

I suspect that, as editor, he would blanch a bit at finding anything there attributed specifically to *him*; he would have said - and on occasion did say - "I was there", but would go on to point out that there were many contributors and many contributions. That said, it is the first instance I can find of the Robustness Principle:

  The implementation of a protocol must be robust.  Each implementation
  must expect to interoperate with others created by different
  individuals.  While the goal of this specification is to be explicit
  about the protocol there is the possibility of differing
  interpretations.  In general, an implementation should be conservative
  in its sending behavior, and liberal in its receiving behavior.  That
  is, it should be careful to send well-formed datagrams, but should
  accept any datagram that it can interpret (e.g., not object to
  technical errors where the meaning is still clear).

The comment, in various forms, is repeated in IENs 112, 123, 124, 128, and 129, and in RFCs 760, 761, 791, and 793.

On Aug 16, 2010, at 3:09 PM, Sean Turner wrote:

> I'm sure somebody who has been around longer than me can offer up a date ;)
> 
> spt
> 
> 
> Fred Baker wrote:

---

From: Mark Nottingham <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 17 Aug 2010 13:04:45 +1000

That's going to be hard to fit on a t-shirt, Fred.

*ducks*

--
Mark Nottingham     http://www.mnot.net/

---

From: Dave CROCKER <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 16 Aug 2010 14:39:30 -0700

> or http://www.pdphoto.org/PictureDetail.php?mat=&pg=7634

Given that the pun is based on Vint's observing that we had IP running "over" 
all sorts of different media, as I recall his comment was "IP over Everything".

d/

-- 

   Dave Crocker
   Brandenburg InternetWorking
   bbiw.net

---

From: Dave CROCKER <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 16 Aug 2010 20:14:02 -0700

>> both in terms of concepts and in terms of text.

how about just capturing the essence of the IETF with:

     There have been many contributors to this document
     both in terms of concepts and in terms of text.

                         --Jon Postel
                           Editor
                           IEN 111
                           August 1979

d/
-- 

   Dave Crocker

---

From: Christian Huitema <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 17 Aug 2010 04:13:55 +0000

Classic:

IP over everything

(dog optional)

-----Original Message-----
From: [email-masked] [mailto:[email-masked]] On Behalf Of Mark Nottingham
Sent: Monday, August 16, 2010 8:05 PM
To: Fred Baker
Cc: [email-masked]; [email-masked]
Subject: Re: IETF Logo Wear

*ducks*

On 17/08/2010, at 8:34 AM, Fred Baker wrote:

>>>> We obviously need an IETF branded one of these:  
>>>> http://www.cafepress.com/+theres_127001_infant_bodysuit,111188172
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> --->  Phil
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> At the request of the community the IAOC and the IETF Trust have 
>>>> approved the establishment of an online store from which the 
>>>> community can buy IETF logo wear.
>>>>

---

From: Jorge Amodio <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 16 Aug 2010 23:29:45 -0500

An updated version based on the 6LoWPAN and other fronts work could be:

"IP on Anything"

Cheers
Jorge

---

From: John C Klensin <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 17 Aug 2010 16:08:52 -0400

--On Monday, August 16, 2010 14:39 -0700 Dave CROCKER
<[email-masked]> wrote:

> Given that the pun is based on Vint's observing that we had IP
> running "over" all sorts of different media, as I recall his
> comment was "IP over Everything".

Yes.  His comment and his tee-shirt.

   john

---

From: Ole Jacobsen <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 18 Aug 2010 08:28:55 -0700 (PDT)

But his T-shirt says "IP *on* Everything" which makes it funnier.

http://jboss-uat.crn.com/channel-encyclopedia/definition-print.htm?term=IP+on+Everything&printType=image

Ole

---

From: Jorge Amodio <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 18 Aug 2010 11:42:09 -0500

> Given that the pun is based on Vint's observing that we had IP running
> "over" all sorts of different media, as I recall his comment was "IP over
> Everything".
>
> d/

I remember Vint wearing the T-shirt on the SFO Inet meeting, I think
it was 1993, and I believe is the same T-shirt when he was featured on
the cover of Boardwatch Mag.

The T-shirt clearly said "IP on Everything", but I agree that in the
context of those days it meant "over" everything, such as Ethernet,
P2P, TDM, OCx, FR, ATM, SMDS, X.25, you name it.

I like the Internet Staff with a variant,  "Internet Staff != ICANN employee"

Cheers
Jorge

---

From: Lixia Zhang <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2010 09:19:59 -0700

> http://jboss-uat.crn.com/channel-encyclopedia/definition-print.htm?term=IP+on+Everything&printType=image

my english is not good, but doesn't "on" carry more significant meaning over "over"?
over only means that ip pkts get carried over (so the everything here only means different carrier)

with on, "everything" can have a much broader range, from your toaster to mars

---

From: Ole Jacobsen <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2010 09:23:34 -0700 (PDT)

On Thu, 19 Aug 2010, Lixia Zhang wrote:

> my english is not good, but doesn't "on" carry more significant 
> meaning over "over"? over only means that ip pkts get carried over 
> (so the everything here only means different carrier)
> 

The joke is: "I pee on everything."

Ole

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From: Philip Nesser <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2010 09:32:35 -0700

IIRC the phrase started out as "IP over Everthing" back in the days when
there was still competing network protocols and we were writing standards
for IP over Infiniband,  IP over IEEE <blah>,  etc  since there were
"competing" protocols  X.25 over blah,  IPX over blah, CNLP over blah,
etc... and network adaptors were still fairly pricey.  At some point in the
mid-90s the emphasis started to shift and we started thinking of almost
anything being an "end point" and it became more "IP on Everything".

--->  Phil

---

From: Jorge Amodio <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2010 11:37:12 -0500

> The joke is: "I pee on everything."

That's right and it was hilarious to see three-piece suit wearing Vint
show it up when we all were drinking beers outside the hotel at some
sort of party during Inet-SFO.

Cheers
Jorge

---

From: Dave CROCKER <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2010 09:45:12 -0700

> The joke is: "I pee on everything."

It occurs to me that this aspect of our history -- and especially the 
confirmation of it demonstrated by the length of this thread -- probably 
explains much of our style for conducting business.

We really should not be at all surprised that participants are so often pissed off.

d/

-- 

   Dave Crocker

---

From: Ted Ts'o <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 20 Aug 2010 10:21:46 -0400

> anything being an "end point" and it became more "IP on Everything".

Of course, there's also "IP by carrier pigeon".

"IP on/over carrier pigeon" just doesn't sound right.  :-)

    	    	    	    	 	 - Ted